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Neotone
Joined: 04/22/02
Posts: 70
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How many downloads do you usually get?
Thursday, January 8, 2009 at 3:51 PM
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Just curious...
I got 642 downloads in December, when I released "The World".
EDIT: I actually released "The World" in late November... but most of the hits for it came in December.
This life is a joke, and nobody's laughing.
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A Bit Crusher
Joined: 01/26/02
Location: Tilburg
Posts: 1794
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Friday, January 9, 2009 at 5:15 AM
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Well, many people are free from work in December....(?)
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Neotone
Joined: 04/22/02
Posts: 70
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Friday, January 9, 2009 at 4:39 PM
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Actually, song activity for me peaked in July, but I think those must have been more streams than downloads. I uploaded six songs in July. But I think "The World" scored big because I put a lot of work into it. I was more perfectionist about that song than ever in the past.
However, you know what the weird thing is... the second biggest download of last year for me was Dreamwind. Not only did the song not get very good reviews, but it wasn't very well mastered. I really should make a remake of that song if people are going to be downloading it...
This life is a joke, and nobody's laughing.
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Sonic Wallpaper
Joined: 05/22/01
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1266
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Friday, January 9, 2009 at 5:50 PM
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For December, 14 of my tracks had over 200 downloads and streams.
Here are my total stats for Dec (based on 111 mp3s)
Total Downloads: 3871
Total Preview: 1226
Total Streams: 825
Total Ringtones: 142
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A Bit Crusher
Joined: 01/26/02
Location: Tilburg
Posts: 1794
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Saturday, January 10, 2009 at 6:16 AM
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Period Totals
Total Downloads: 2476
Total Preview: 0
Total Streams: 1272
Total Ringtones: 28
(55 songs.....)
Wow...that's pretty cool....
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Neotone
Joined: 04/22/02
Posts: 70
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Saturday, January 10, 2009 at 5:07 PM
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Good job ABC! At least from my point of view 
This life is a joke, and nobody's laughing.
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A Bit Crusher
Joined: 01/26/02
Location: Tilburg
Posts: 1794
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Sunday, January 11, 2009 at 11:00 AM
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Wintermute
Joined: 08/29/01
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 35
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Monday, January 19, 2009 at 2:55 AM
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It varies, but Dec was:
Total Downloads: 4011
Total Preview: 0
Total Streams: 839
Total Ringtones: 2
Wintermute  |
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A Bit Crusher
Joined: 01/26/02
Location: Tilburg
Posts: 1794
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Monday, January 19, 2009 at 12:26 PM
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(((stereofect)))
Joined: 09/02/01
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1333
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Thursday, January 22, 2009 at 5:29 AM
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I average about 300 d/l's a month. And taking into consideration my musical(?) style I'd say that's pretty good.
“Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius — and a lot of courage — to move in the opposite direction.” Albert Einstein
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A Bit Crusher
Joined: 01/26/02
Location: Tilburg
Posts: 1794
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Friday, January 23, 2009 at 7:43 AM
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AS RULES!!!!!!
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Neotone
Joined: 04/22/02
Posts: 70
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Saturday, January 24, 2009 at 12:09 AM
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Yes... upstart artists like us would probably never get more than a couple downloads if we were on MySpace. We'd never get on the front page, no one would notice, and no one would care, so we'd all sink into oblivion. Except perhaps Wintermute...
This life is a joke, and nobody's laughing.
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Wintermute
Joined: 08/29/01
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 35
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Thursday, January 29, 2009 at 6:49 AM
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Neotone wrote:Yes... upstart artists like us would probably never get more than a couple downloads if we were on MySpace. We'd never get on the front page, no one would notice, and no one would care, so we'd all sink into oblivion. Except perhaps Wintermute...
First off, remember Neotone, I have your great station to thank--I can tell your station is getting me a lot of new exposure; thank you for that. And when you look at my numbers remember that that reflect about 350--ABC, you stats at 55 songs is very impressive--last year(200 my top song was:
Digital Morphine( 2nd Addiction mix) (ID:17904)
song total: 755 52 0 0
The year was:
2008
Total Downloads: 42965 Total Preview: 0
Total Streams: 15479 Total Ringtones: 4
Which I was happy with since there are two things here that I was happy about
1) The Downloads to Streams ratio, this and what I have seen in the Web page stats here is that people are looking for Wintermute songs via Google and the such
2) People seem to be hitting many Wintermute songs here, the "wealth" of the traffic last year was pretty much spread over all of my songs here--saturation
I had intentionally "slowed" production last year to try and let the listener base "catch up"--a very negative side effect hi production numbers is how much it overwhelms potential fans 
I would like to comment on myspace. As some of you may or may not know, I kinda conducted an experiment between Tagworld, they are now called something else, and MySpace. Both of them at the time were the fastest rising stars in the social net world, but there was one very big difference between them: MySpace seem to be setup for the major labels more and Tagworld was "courting" the labels. Both allowed any artist to upload songs and users could share them via players, but at the time myspace only allow just "anybody" a max of four songs in contrast Tagworld allowed nearly unlimited. When I created my account at myspace, they were both created around the same time, I uploaded my 4 tracks and completed with about 3000 other artists and labels. I dropped about 100 tracks on Tagworld and set up to be competitive against about 300 other artists--most completely unknown or rising stars. Within s few months streams/dls at MySpace were ok considering I had 4 tracks, but a Tagworld, things were much different, d/ls were through the roof--and the "majors" were starting to show, tagworld was a major player at that years SXSW. But even though they were rising against MySpace in the music world, one thing they were not doing was changing the way they treated _all_ of their artist--The major labels were not given anything special. With in a few month Wintermute and a few other "key" unsigned artists were "slugging" it out with very major players--James Blunt was my "Nemesis" at TW. This couldn't have made the majors happy as eventually the top artist chart at the main music page went away to be replaced with "top 10 songs" The 4 to 6 months the Majors had watched their top stars and groomed new artists get there asses handed to them by yours truly and a few other "unsigned" artists. "Throughout Time" got over 60,000 streams and shares alone, at the peak I was over 500,000 hits and streams for the year. What was the main reason for this?, because with TW I could "out produce" the majors and drown them in variety, not just in Trance and Electronica and Ambient, but in all charts Wintermute never left the top 80 in nearly two years, at the peak I think there were on the order of about 30k total artists at TW. This showed me, I could conceivably compete against the majors, in a marketing "Vacuum"--TW was a closed market that seemed to be unaffected by what "promotion" the majors did in the "real world" And people loved it, they loved having the ability to "find" artists for them selves. Ultimately Tagworld fell apart and became something else, but it gave me a chance to see what a "grassroots" approach is capable of--I have never made Wintermute a "priority" in my life and have for the last 9 years--yes Wintermute is due to turn 10 this year--little to no know interest in touring or large marketing attempts--although over the last year I have grown very tired of the "9 to 5" world of programming game. I really dislike contracting, but that seems to be only reliable means around here (Austin) and I have thought more and more about doing more major things with Wintermute--The recent releases of a Trance version of Wagner's "Die Walküre" (The Valkyries/Ride of the Valkyries) and the "Knights of Cydonia" sequel/follow up song--not a remix a completely independent song that "continues" the story from Muse's KOC are forays in to more "main stream" exposure. Sorry to go into the lengthy post, but I wanted to let Neotone and others know others know what has been going on with me and Wintermute. Album wise I am about 3 to 4 releases "behind", my last major Wintermute release through Blue Water Records was two years ago  And I have been trying to decide which of the 3 pending albums (Pattern Recognition, Digital Kingdoms, Electronicus Arcana Majoris, not to mention the 2 cd "Epic" that is $yn326y (Synergy) )to try and release next. EAM is the most done, but then again it is a 22 song album--a song for each of 22 major arcana cards in the Tarot deck--death, The Sun, The Lovers, The Fool, etc. One major hold up with that album is the Tarot cards themselves--yes there will be a Wintermute designed Tarot cards to complement each track, so for instance in iTunes, which allows you to have a piece of art per song on an album, you will see unique Wintermute art for each song. The other big issue is perfecting 22 songs not to mention they cannot be over 3:30 minutes to fit on a standard CD, think about it, a 3 min Wintermute song?, but it does work... at least, I like them Neotone I am sorry I left you hanging on your bass questions a while back, I meant no disrespect This last year was probably the worst year of my life, outside of Wintermute that is. But hey, depression and loss is supposed to be good for the artist
All in all, any exposure you get here at AS is great. I have learned over the years that this place is a good barometer of the shape of things to come in the music biz. The repeat listeners you get here are truly "grassroots" and more than likely will be lifelong fans.
Sorry for the long post 
WM
Wintermute |
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Neotone
Joined: 04/22/02
Posts: 70
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Thursday, January 29, 2009 at 8:19 PM
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Very interesting post, Matt.
Sorry to hear you've had a bad year... hopefully you have some artist or someone who can inspire you out of it. I know it helped to get me through some bad straits listening to "Hope", and lately "Throughout Time" has been on my mind, reminding me of impermanence.
It seems strange that record labels would behave like that. I would imagine that record labels would benefit from a place where unsigned artists can slug it out, and they can see which ones get popular. From my perspective, the record labels are providing a service--tour routes, CD production, and marketing--in exchange for a cut of royalty. This cooperation between artist and label should rake in additional money, more than any artist who has to focus mainly on producing music. So, everybody wins. But if they just shut out new artists, then everybody loses... their artists will still under-perform, and new artists won't take their place.
It's interesting that you got so many listeners despite the fact that you're not interested in touring. Do you at least perform live sometimes? I read somewhere that selling CDs at performances accounts for 75% of the money made by indy musicians. That's why I'm currently trying to get my act together and start a live act. I am a bit concerned about the fact that it will just be myself, because my music is often very complicated and seemingly hard to do on the fly--something one reviewer here once chastised me for, in fact (he called it "noisy" production). It'll be interesting to see how I pull it all together.
I love the idea that I may well start touring with my music. Look at the place where I grew up:
http://the.palouse.net/potlatch/photos/photos.htm
Imagine a serious techno artist coming from a place like that. The downtown bar is full of brawling drunks, and at least 80% of the people I talk to listen to country music--and I talk to the college students! Though I have grown to like the countryside here in Idaho, and it shows... my latest album is very naturalistic, and I've always preferred the outdoor raves... kinda strange!
This life is a joke, and nobody's laughing.
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Wintermute
Joined: 08/29/01
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 35
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Friday, January 30, 2009 at 12:50 AM
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Neotone wrote:Very interesting post, Matt.
Why thank you, it is rare that I do...300+ songs just don't produce themselves
but seriously, I just can't seem to discipline myself enough to be a regular poster or reviewer--the only thing in my life that has been uncontrollably compulsive to me is creating: poetry/art/music
Quote:Sorry to hear you've had a bad year... hopefully you have some artist or someone who can inspire you out of it. I know it helped to get me through some bad straits listening to "Hope", and lately "Throughout Time" has been on my mind, reminding me of impermanence.
Thank you again but you know, what doesn't kill us, makes us create more music ;)
[quote]It seems strange that record labels would behave like that. I would imagine that record labels would benefit from a place where unsigned artists can slug it out, and they can see which ones get popular. From my perspective, the record labels are providing a service--tour routes, CD production, and marketing--in exchange for a cut of royalty. This cooperation between artist and label should rake in additional money, more than any artist who has to focus mainly on producing music. So, everybody wins. But if they just shut out new artists, then everybody loses... their artists will still under-perform, and new artists won't take their place.[\quote]
Ah so true, but there are two issues here:
1) The industry likes to "predict" artist success--they know if they drop 1mil + into an artist that they(the label) will devote their to push that artist to the top. One of the reason the Internet has always scared the labels so much, is it is completely random and uncontrollable--viral videos come to mind as a recent example of this. The labels have had over 50 years of total control over what the public "likes". We have been so conditioned over that time period to have certain music appeal to us so that this model is true and predictable:
a) song writing house + artist + label/studio = song/album
b) radio stations/Video shows + preview reviews * additional money the label pumps in to pre -promotion = perceived (from the consumers view point) consumer demand
c) consumer(infused with idea that they "need" to own this artist) + stores (both brick and mortar, and online) = money for the label/studio/songwriting house and lastly the artist.
and blah blah blah, you get the idea. Even though this is a very simplified and somewhat cynical--ok very cynical--viewpoint of the industry, it just is one way showing the control that they(the major 3 labels) have over peoples music taste. This was the way the world of music pretty much worked up until about 1998-1999 when the web and pretty much everything else online caught fire and radically changed the way the world worked. The first part of the "new musical revolution(mp3.com term and concept) was an "avalanche" of artists and music that not only showed the general public that there was a lot more to music that they ever knew before but it buried them in basically, well crap. It has taken awhile but I think over the last few years that has finally settled and people are starting to be more constant in music in two ways:
1) The are more open to purely digital music
2) The concept or perception of what music and a "band" has radically changed The industry has tried to roll with all of this, but there "classic" model of music and music consumption has been ever damaged. More and more I see people with a wide variety of what they like, the idea of brand (aka "artist" ) loyalty has been shattered. However despite the "rolling" that the industry has done, they remain to be resistant to change and try and "squash" "upstart" artists at every turn--"Solja" boy comes to mind. I have seen more "explosive" (aka uncontrolled) growth and _truely_ innovative music and art are coming to the surface.
Quote: It's interesting that you got so many listeners despite the fact that you're not interested in touring. Do you at least perform live sometimes? I read somewhere that selling CDs at performances accounts for 75% of the money made by indy musicians. That's why I'm currently trying to get my act together and start a live act. j
Yes I have thought about the more "traditional" stuff, but all in all, no... I have not even performed live even once. I have thought about doing an "internet" concert, but still not sure.
If Wintermute gets more of a draw/demand for it, then I would be more likely to consider something like touring. Yes, those are the numbers I have heard too, around 75%. But for the most part, the "tour" is a device of the industry. Many artists have gone broke touring, David Bowie at his height of popularity had this happen more than once. So for now, Wintermute fan base growth is "grassroots" at best, and it is starting to "take", even if slowly.
Quote: I am a bit concerned about the fact that it will just be myself, because my music is often very complicated and seemingly hard to do on the fly--something one reviewer here once chastised me for, in fact (he called it "noisy" production). It'll be interesting to see how I pull it all together.
One thing that never stops amazing me, what the people want or like of your music. There are sooo many songs I have put very little to no effort in and they are constantly "gold" as far as how they impact and stay with Wintermute listeners. WM songs that are "low" in production value in regards to time to create and release (this is time from initial start(creation of the flp file and scoring/creating) to upload, give or take and hour:
"Ghost Nation" : 3 hours
"Spaces" : 1 day
"Chillstorm": 5 hours
"House of the Sun": 1 day
"Hope" the first mix (lightspeed): maybe a day, but it was about 12 hours
"Metropolis III ("The Fall") : 13 hours
"Wintermute II (Flatline Dreams) : 9 hours
"Life in the Machine" (the whole album: 9 songs/cover art/playlist/etc) : 1 month
"Midnight" : 3 days
there are a lot of songs: "Sons of the Law of One", all remaining versions of "Hope", most of my Trance stuff, that had "tons" of production, 1 month per song up to a year total in some cases, that never "took" no matter how much I thought they would, or all the "high production" versions were never as popular as the version or song that I almost didn't release because I didn't think they would "work" with ppl: "300", The current Wintermute chart top: "The Eternal voyage of the Heart", etc that I still can't belief people even remotely like Bottom line, better not to try and second guess things, just make music--a lot of it--breath it--be it--people will like what they like I always make music for me if the listeners like it too, cool, but don't try and force it, Anthems are born, not made...
Quote: I love the idea that I may well start touring with my music. Look at the place where I grew up: http://the.palouse.net/potlatch/photos/photos.htmImagine a serious techno artist coming from a place like that. The downtown bar is full of brawling drunks, and at least 80% of the people I talk to listen to country music--and I talk to the college students! Though I have grown to like the countryside here in Idaho, and it shows... my latest album is very naturalistic, and I've always preferred the outdoor raves... kinda strange! :
Very cool, just follow your heart, that is what "Eternal Voyage..." is about and meant to inspire, just follow it... and don't try to predict the outcome ;)
Wintermute |
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Kat Yidaki
Joined: 01/10/02
Posts: 21
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Tuesday, February 3, 2009 at 2:01 PM
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I totally scrape the bottle of the barrel with the amounts of downloads I get. It's actually truly pathetic. My most popular track at the moment is a very old one inspired by a web comic, which basically consists of me getting off on my bass guitar on top of a drum & bass beat. I put it up there since people kept asking about it on forums and such. Figures...
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Danny K
Joined: 08/15/01
Posts: 226
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Tuesday, February 3, 2009 at 4:44 PM
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Kat - that is upsetting because your stuff is good and deserves to be heard. Maybe there could be scope there for a repackaging of your material.
Download figures are - afterall a good indicator of how good your promotional material is over and above the quality of your output.
As to platforms for music - these days I mainly concentrate on last.fm - though I have come to regret not giving my mp3's consistent id3 tags over the years. lol
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Kat Yidaki
Joined: 01/10/02
Posts: 21
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Thursday, February 5, 2009 at 2:56 AM
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Danny K wrote:Kat - that is upsetting because your stuff is good and deserves to be heard. Maybe there could be scope there for a repackaging of your material.
Well, I do still need a lot of work on my arrangement skills. I think I also need to put out a bit more--I can see why people lose interest in an artist who doesn't offer anything new in months. There are just too many folks out there doing great stuff.
Still, I'm a featured artist 'n stuff. That's actually kinda funny 
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Second Thought
Joined: 05/05/02
Location: Oh God knows.
Posts: 188
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RE: How many downloads do you usually get?
Monday, February 16, 2009 at 3:23 PM
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Total Downloads: 1005 Total Preview: 326
Total Streams: 55 Total Ringtones: 0
This is utterly staggering, considering I haven't actually promoted Second Thought in any way in about two years, stuck in a world of recording an album I've eventually scrapped while trying to vaguely get my life onto any sort of track as I've been. Yet 1000 downloads in December? Who ARE these people? Poor bastards are downloading some poorly produced stuff I've got up there, too!
Drug use for children has for many an education and with obvious alarm to both parents on the increase almost yearly.
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